Wednesday, March 02, 2005

NPR Stupid

Listening to NPR has long been an adrenalin rush for me. I’m not much for biker bars – but listening to our tax funded propaganda machine gives me my daily dose of suffering. This morning I decide to keep track of the News and Feature stories presented to see if my opinion of the daily does of disaster was real or imagined. Here’s a total report of every topic discussed. Feel free to draw you own conclusions – I have already tipped my hand.

7:00 AM - TOP OF THE HOUR news presented the following reports:
1. Two Baghdad bombings kill 10 Iraqi soldiers.
2. Gunmen kill one of Saddam’s judges and the judge’s lawyer son.
3. Hong Kong Head being forced to resign after Beijing loses faith in him.
4. Debate in Congress – Democrats push bankruptcy exemption for combat vets.
5. Ten Commandments to be debated before Supreme Court today.
6. Death Penalty of juveniles ruled unconstitutional.
7. Bush assignation plotter held without bond.
8. Rejection of “Gay Bashing” law in Kansas.
9. Home mortgage applications down although sales are up. Price of homes up 11.2% for the last year.

KUED comes on for their “local” report;
1. Three Legislative bills discussed
a. Call for money for nursing home for vets.
b. More freedom for midwives stalled!
c. Different colored drivers-privilege card being forced on Undocumented Aliens
2. Springdale town manager pleads guilty.
3. Utah home prices go up! Utah now 37th in nation – well below national average but headed up.

1. Supreme Court on the Ten Commandments – Most displays put up in the last 50 years were publicity stunts for the Ten Commandments Movie.
2. (Utah Report) 5A Basketball state scores – Jazz to play.
3. Howard Dean – Like a Rock Star in Mississippi reenergizes the party from the ground up.
4. Dateline Vermont: - statewide town meetings vote to oppose the use of Vermont National Guard Troops in Iraq war.

Bottom of the Hour news:
1. Killing of Iraqi Judge
2. Killing of Iraqi soliders
3. Ten Commandments debated at Supreme Court.
4. Bill before congress will make it harder to erase debut through bankruptcy – Dems want more exclusions.

Utah at the Bottom of the Hour
1. Drivers permit for aliens is called raciest.
2. Attack on No Child Left Behind blocked
3. Sales Tax (State portion) earmarked for road repair – taking money away from education and other programs.
4. Privacy destroyed by driving privilege card – the opponents of the bill hold up picture of dead Marine to show that undocumented aliens serve their country and then are humiliated by raciest color coded cards. Undocumented labor [exploited] for the advantage of Utah’s economy.


1. Home land security putting ankle bracelets on illegal aliens rather than putting them in prisons while awaiting their court dates. Reporter claimed that “runaway aliens” are the government’s fault.
2. Bernard Evans World Com. trial.
3. World of Work – “What is Tom Daschle up to now that he is out of office?” Sounds fun!! Boy we miss him! Options: Think Tanks? Law Firms? Investment Institutions? US Senate?

TOP OF THE HOUR NEWS – repeats 7:00 AM stories.

1. Car Levin (Democrat Senator who voted against the war) is brought on to assess the successes in the war on terror of the last few months. His assessment – there have been no real success yet – everything could still fall apart – give us ten years to know for sure.
2. Egypt’s President has released opposition leaders and called for multi party arrangement – This is discussed by an Egyptian Enemy of Mubarak who is asked if it can be attributed to Bush – when he says yes, his interviewer points out that the most powerful opposition groups are terrorist organizations. He is asked if associating democracy with Bush will damage its chances in the Middle East.
3. Full story on court striking down juvenile death penalty and predictions that “life without parole” will also be considered cruel and unusual punishment. NPR gave support to the idea that other nations could determine US law.
4. Dead Cubin author memorialized by a movie maker – This was a Cubin living in excel and trying to keep freedom alive for his people.

1. Giant Lobster that no one could eat – it just wouldn’t be right!.
2. Killings in Baghdad
3. Bombings in Baghdad
4. Madrid bombers linked to New York Subway
5. US concerns about Iranian Nuclear program
6. Ten Commandments debated in Supreme Court

1. Colored licenses for illegal aliens
2. Utah angry over No Child Left Behind – bill HB135 blocked for now. Utah’s “Red State” status makes White House nervous.
3. State budget limitations – highway investment fund. HB 18
4. Driving Privilege card once more mentioning “extorting” labor and racial profiling.

LAST FIFTEEN MINUETS – Human Interest Stories:
1. Matsui’s wife – she is running as a democrat for her dead husband’s empty congressional seat. The story turns into a political commercial for Ms. Matsui
2. Basketball story by Frank DeForge which talks about the “White Man’s Disease” that makes European Basketball players better that American Whites and European style of BB superior to American – example – our loss in the last Olympics.
3. A discussion of capitalist patronage of 18th century music.

9:00 AM - At last the two hours were up. The only story that could be construed as “conservative” was the one about the Dead Cuban author. But how conservative can a Cuban be?. Boy could we use a good biker bar!


Ares said...

Ok, I for one am tired of the running total of soldiers killed being the top news story every time I turn on the radio. I realize that these are our heroes and we need to honor those that have died, but it seems to me that it is more a 'look at how many lives Bush's mistake has cost us' and not a 'hail the victorious dead' type of story.
Perhaps it only shows my ignorance, but what was being debated by the Supreme Court about the Ten Commandments?
I also personally think that it is rather ironic that the Democrats are mainly against war but want benefits for the combat vets? How does that work?
I think, however that the news of house sales going up is a rather conservative piece of news. It shows the economy continuing to grow, something that liberals obviously don't want.
Howard Dean? Rock Star? whatever.
I think that it is abundantly clear that the NPR is extremely liberal and needs to be reinged in and be more objective in its reporting if it wants any kind of conservative audience (besides of course Lysis).

Dan Simpson said...

Though you would think the housing story would be a good predictor of growing economy, in fact they were trying to say that prices are going up. Not mentioning that this is good for everyone selling a house.

As far as NPR in general. The only thing it needs is its public funding pulled. Period. I don't fund Rush Limbaugh, or any other political commentator, I don't want to fund NPR.

a quiet listener said...

The ongoing debate over whether the Ten Commandments should exist in public places is analogous to the previous blog here on "gay marriage settled"

Supreme Courte Justices have interpreted the Constitution to have a seperation of church and state. period.

There are several inconsistincies with the Ten Commandments and the Constitution if both are to be interpreted literally.

For example, one of the most important freedoms held by Americans is their freedom of religion. Long has religious tolerance been an aspiration of just men in this nation. However, the first of the ten commandments requires that no god other than Yahweh is to be worshipped. If we are to hang the commandments as a basis for ethical and moral behaviour in our law ther is an apparent contradiction to our religous tolerance.

the Ten Commandments were created within an entirely different culture with very different expectations of its citizens. It was a theocracy where church and state were blended. Everyone was expected to follow the state religion. A person following a different religion or proselytizing a different faith could find themselves sentenced to death. (Keep in mind that the Jews thought even mentioning God's name was blasphemous and a worthy reason to be put to death.)

However, some would say that the Ten Commandments were obviously written by diferent people under different circumstances and that pictures, statues or monuments depicting them in court rooms are simply examples of early courts. Arguably that could be. The Ten Commandments are symbolic of the contract that people make with thier leaders (be it God or thier elected officials) to uphold and obey certain truths in the form of law. Literally they represent a historical event and process... and in that case then perhaps there is no problem in displaying them as such. A piece of history. A prototype at best.

Certainly those opposed to the accepted "Christian" ideals presented in the Ten Commandments do not have to feel pressured to abide by their tenants.

I mention Christianity in quotes because I wonder sometimes how much even Christianity even obeys the Ten Commandments. Certainly the day of rest as set forth in the commandments has been duly ignored and set aside by many professing Christianity. Or also, depending on your interpretation of the "no graven images" commandment then MANY MANY individuals have been commiting horrid idolaty as far as literal interpretation of the commandments goes.

In short... There is a great difference between what the Ten Commandments actually state and expect of those who would follow them, and what we, the general public, perceive that they say.

and the debates go on and on over this.

Dan Simpson said...

I have one problem with your argument, after the hundreds of supreme court cases that I have read, I refuse to simply say "the supreme court ruled thusly, that is how it should be."

The first ammendment restricts the federal government (and now the states) from establishing religion, as well as from curtailing the free excercise thereof.

The problem, in my opinion, is the misunderstanding of the term "establishment". In the days of the drafting of the Constitution and "established" religion was one that had legally mandatory attendance, and tithing. When the government establishes a state religion, and enforces its doctrinal dictates that is an established religion.

I would like someone to explain some of these ideas (some coming straight from the supremem court.)

A nativity scene is unconstitutional on public ground.

A menorah is not.

A nativity scene is okay IF you also have reindeer.

An individual can recieve federal grants to go to school, but not if they are getting a degree in theology.

Private schools can recieve funding, but not if they are religious.

While I think the ideas originally codified in the first amendment are some of the most precious ideas any society has ever embraced, I think that our current society has taken them to the point that upholding the first aspect "no establishment" has begun to curtail the second "free excercise". And of the two, I believe supporting free excercise will, in the long run, protect both much better than elevating this extraconstitutional notion of "separation of church and state."

a quiet listener said...

I do believe that we both see things eye to eye. Just because a Judge or anyone for that matter interprets something in a certain way certainly does not make that interpretation just. It may or may not be. Our government simply appoints those individuals. To them is given the opportunity to cast their judgement and we obey the law as dictated. That doesn't mean we should change our moral position to fit in line with their ruling, all the contrary, we should voice our opinions in the hopes of changing things for the better.

Anonymous said...

Blowhard here . . . .
Lysis :
"How is it that you can see the mote in your brother's eye and not see the beam in your own eye?"
(To quote from a famous "non-Greek")
-Forteen percent of NPR's operating budget of 100 mil comes from gov't monies.
-According to the tax appraiser's office for Pinellas County, Florida the dollar amount of exempt real estate held by religions in PINELLAS COUNTY ALONE IS: $583,581,970.00. Somehow I was unable to find a corresponding figure for Utah county or Salt Lake City, or Utah, or the LDS church.
-The National Council of Churches, The Presbyterian Church, the National Council, use 20% of their annual untaxed income for lobbying efforts.
-The LDS churh does not release this information.

The Daily Fare of KSL Radio:

12:00am 3:00 am Lars Larson Show
3:00am 4:00am Wall Street Journal
4:00am 9:00am Utah's morning news
(now I could add a comment about the sanitized reporting that goes on here, but some believe that God's voice is heard on KSL so let's just say "fair and balanced"
9:00-1200am The Doug Wright Show
Wright is "far-right"
12:00-1:00 more "Fair& Balanced" news with stock market reports.
1:00-4:00 The Sean Hannity Show
More "fair and Balanced" than anybody, and is not a pimp for the Republican party.
4:00-7:00 "Fair and Balanced" news with spin offered by recently fired BYU coaches and ass't coaches after particularly embarrassing loses to the U of U.
7;00-9:00 The Radio Factor with Bill O'Reilly (A con-host with a ribald history of "conquests" that he is/has been sued for, but Bill Clinton is worse, so it's OK!)
9:00-11:00pm The Lars Larson Show
5 HOURS of Lars a day -- just as venal as Rush, but not as expensive to fund the oxy. Conservatism on the cheap if you will.
11:00-12:00 When Radio was. Nice show for "old timers" -My favorite

Let's see, that makes 14 hours of unabashed and unquestioned conservativism A DAY -- all prefaced with. "KSL in no way represents the views . . . ."

I think this is a lie! And we all know what Lysis thinks of liars!

Now, Lysis, tell me that KSL is completely financially separate from the LDS church and receives no tax monies for the operation of the station.
Don't make me use the "L" word . . .

No ONE listens to more KSL than I -- probably 5 to 1 over NPR. However, NPR did describe the Iraqi election in great detail -- three whole hours of interviews and information that described the ballot and even candidate strategies with objectivity. NO talk show host on KSL would bother to bore their readers with such drivel -- not nearly as exciting as bashing Ted Kennedy or Robert Byrd.

Apollo said...

(with the aid of Ares)

Well lawdee dawdee! Good job you named one conservative Station. We congratulate you. All this time I , Apollo, thought that all media was liberal. Thank you for ending this misconseption.

With the ten commandments, I thought there was a seperation of church and state. That's what made the Romans so powerful. Was it not the supreme court itself that said there should be a seperation of church and state? Now they're changing their minds? I guess I could expect no less. You know who this reminds us of? Good old John Kerry.

I don't know, I, Ares, think that the Supreme Court should monitor their own decisions of the past. Look at Plessy vs. Ferguson and Brown vs. Board of Education, for example. I agree with a quiet listener when he said that just because the power is given to the Supreme Court to interpret law does not make that interpretation just.
To the matter of NPR and KSL, it is not proven nor is it likely that the LDS Church is involved with KSL unless they have already come out and said that they were. The LDS Church does not take a political stand on most issues (abortion and gay marriage being two of the very few exceptions) but it does invite its members to go and vote and take a stand, they do not in any way try to influence its members one way or the other. The plain fact of the matter is that NPR is publicly funded (which is code of our tax money) and it clearly does not represent the interests of all the people or even the majority. It is not "Fair and Balanced" and if any radio talk show should be, it should be the one that is paid for with our tax money. As to the observation about real estate in Florida, I fail to see how that is relevant to NPR in any way. Most likely just the murmurings of an old man too worried about the "unbalanced ways" of Utah. All I have to say to anyone in this attitude is, "You are free to leave as soon as you wish. Don't let the doornob hit you on the butt on the way out."

Apollo wants back on.

The whole issue of the opinions of the talk shows, if they were not opinionated, they wouldn't be listened to or supported. I know they're supposed to be unbiased but let's face it, they are biased. It's just one of those facts of life. I hate how they try to get us to believe how the whole Bush Administration is totaly made out to be "evil"! Look at the whole election! My favorite saying of Lysis' is "You can tell Bush beat Kerry at the debate because the polls say they tied." That's because they are all left wing (the broadcast news stations). It makes me sick. Another time was when Rumsfeld went to Iraq to answer the soldiers's questions and the media made it look like he didn't even care about them. The truth was that the media made it that way. In truth he really did care and he gave the best answer for the time he had to come up with that answer. IF you look at the full answer instead of the two line the media showed you would see that the country was well represented and I'm sure you'd feel the same way.

Apollo and Ares

Lysis said...

Thank you all for your comments. I agree with Dannyboy and a_quiet_listener; a Supreme Court ruling does not make something right or wrong. This is the role of the truth and of Natural Law.

My friend Blowhard – it seems that we at least agree to the fact that NPR has a mote in its eye. You seem to suggest that the LDS Church and KSL are my eyes – this is not true. I see plenty of logs in the eyes of both. You could have attacked the “Liberal” leanings of my own web log comments. This is of course what I invite you and all others to do. It is my hope that in the blast of your ideas the logs will be burned up and the motes blown out. On a side note: I think Jesus was a “Greek” Galilee had long been under Greco-Roman control by the time of Jesus’ birth. I remind you that both “Jesus” and “Christ” are Greek names and that the Gospels were originally written in Greek by Greek Scholars. In fact I see a lot more Plato than Ten Commandments in the New Testament. . Be that as it may. In America, churches are exempted from paying taxes to enable them to do things that would cost the state even more money to do through government. If churches do not fulfill their charitable obligations I would join with those who call for removing their tax exempt status; as I now call for removing the tax exempt status of the AARP, the NAACP, and the Sierra Club. Like Apollo and/or Ares I question your belief that the LDS church runs KSL radio. I would be interested in some evidence of this claim. I believe KSL does what ever it can to make money. If more people are willing to pay to listen to Sean Hannity than to Al Frankin, it is the people’s choice. Having said that I don’t think that either the LDS church or KSL pretend to be other than Blowhard has pegged them to be – “unabashed and unquestioned (what ever that means) conservatives”. NRP, on the other hand, not only pretends to present NEWS but does measurable harm to our country and provides palpable aid and comfort to America’s enemies. It does this with our money and without consequence. As Blowhard has pointed out, most Americans have turned off NPR – but it goes on just the same because it gets its money from sources that are not affected by free market realities. We must recognize that NPR is not only supported by tax money, but by liberal contributions from agenda driven and driving organizations. On top of this, KUED is made possible by the U of U, a publicly funded institution. It is one thing to enter into bias by choice as KSL listeners do, it is another to discover bias nursed like a secret parasite on the flesh of the very nation it seeks to destroy. Finally Blowhard, I simply presented NPR’s program, calling it as I saw it – biased and damaging to our country. To through the logs in my, KSL’s or the LDS Church’s eyes at me in answer does not change the fact that NPR is misrepresenting itself as presenting NEWS programs, while in reality spewing propaganda. The job of a defender of NPR would be to disprove this claim, not, in typical relativist fashion, to claim that two wrongs must surely make it right.

Above I have only restated what Apollo said, and I add that I think there is a difference between talk shows like O’Reilly and Franking and what NPR pretends to provide. To pretend to be what you are not is to LIE!

Anonymous said...

Blowhard here . . .
I have to hurry . . . someone is trying to slam a door on my butt(what an odd compulsion),but anyway . . .
Let's take the first 10 examples of NPR's infamousliberal" fare that you listed on this posting.
What sinister propaganda am I to apprehend in "Two Baghdad bombingskill 10 Iraqi soldiers"
Am I to understand that this event didn't happen? Or that the gunman didn't kill one of Sadddam's judges and the judges lawyer son? Or that there was no debate in congress with Democrats pushing bankruptcy exempts for combat vets?
Does offering aid and comfort to the enemy now extend to merely covering certain TOPICS that Lysis does not want anyone to know think about or acknowledge?
Lysis'propaganda radar is so sensitive that it can only find comfort for "us" (who IS us anyway) in only the GOOD news --
anything else is evil propaganda.

Something was written a while ago by Lysis, a reference to a "toy religion" I believe. Comments that inflame an enemy and insult that enemy's religion, I think are examplesof "comforting the enemy by providing a justification for his hatred and "jihad".

Christ should be amazed to find out that he is
Greek because of an occupying force of "Greco/Romans" {is thatwhat the Roman's called themselves?) and translations of his words into Greek. Does that mean Christ spoke Greek and not
Aramaic?. . . someone get hold of Mel Gibson,quick.

" . . . the job of a defender of NPR . . ."
Certainly EVERY media outlet has a bias -- everone is born with first person point of view and, unlike Lysis, I'm not going to procaim one is objective truth and any other which might cause "discomfort" is propaganda harmful to US (there is that word again -- I wonder what it means--since it is used so often by the poster at this site.
But I do know who THEM are.)

Both corporate religion and NPR drink from the same public fountain -- NPR at forteen percent of its 100 mil budget and corporate religion at I suspect a much higher percentage. . . .And that is as "fair and balanced" as I can get.

A_Shadow said...

Ok, let's pull back the reigns, just a tad folks.

Corporate religion? Has to be one of my least favorite terms of all time. Thank you for becoming my least favorite person of the hour. Last time I checked, religions had something called "tithing" in which devout followers would relieve themselves of 10% of their income and donate it to the church and to doing God's will. Hm... Funny how I could come up with that being enough to run an organization. I know of plenty of churches, and church sponsored radio stations that run themselves solely off of this sort of income. One I know for certain simply has a pledge drive once a month to fund its every financial need. It doesn't sound like government subsidising to me. Which of course would cause a liberal outcry about church and state anyways.

Anonymous, in typical fashion you are missing the key points while trying to undermine a mountain based off of a few holes in the face... NPR is reporting one side of the news. That is worthy of the label propaganda, and you and everyone here can't deny that without looking a fool. It's the same as when CNN's "unbiased" news coverage only covers (or mostly covers) Kerry's campaign, and it's the same when Fox news gives a slant one way or the other. The point is that many of the aforementioned don't even try. And additionally NPR is funded by yours, mine and Lysis money. 14% of 100 million dollars is 14 million dollars. Raise your hand if you could find a better use for that much money that didn't involve the propagandisement of the news and media to make the war effort look bad?

Reporting on bombs and U.S. casaulties is propaganda because it demoralizes troops and weakens the publics faith in the military. I need to find an estimate of how many people Saddam tortured and killed in a year, so that every time "# U.S. Soldiers died today" comes up I can say that X# of Iraqis were saved from virtual enslavement. Or should I just give a flat rate of 25 million as their entire population is now heralding the run of democracy?

Reporting on the assassination of an Iraqi judge who was overseeing Saddam's trial is likewise propaganda. If you were next in line for that position, would you want it? Of course not, because you are fearing the same end. But he was fulfilling a just and honorable roll in that position and it still needs to be carried out.

One way they could stop harping on the propaganda of the movement is to home in on the reconstruction effort. Instead of merely stating that "15 Americans died" or some other such thing, they might hone into WHY THEY DIED. Those brave soldiers died in a convoy bent on bringing in medical supplies, or escorting an engineering team so that they may fix up some key component. I have read the reports and seen them. I was fortunate enough to see the bravery of our troops while an embeded reporter was with them and he caught their plight on tape. It's an amazing thing that they go through, they aren't just one more casaulty waiting to happen like some would wish you would believe.

As for who "us" is, as you would like to tangle yourself into semantics instead of addressing the real issues... First of all I would like to point out that only did Apollo/Ares use the word "us" (and only twice), aside from you, AnonymoUS. Save in Lysis original post he used it ONCE to say "give us ten years" in which he was jesting and sarcastically pointing out the democratic opinion on the war, that given ten years it could fall apart.

I was actually ready with a second point, but since you didn't have a leg to stand on, already, and there isn't any context in this post to which you could have possibly referred to, I don't think I need to slap you around with the white glove of truth... At least until you make it a point to rear your head again, and then this charade can start all over again.

Dan Simpson said...

I am curious as to Blowhard's comment about "Corporate Religion" and NPR drinking from the same well of public monies.

How much do you know about our federal tax structure?

Do you consider tax exemption the same thing as the government giving you money out of the general fund?

Do you believe that tax credits, deductions, exemptions, are money from the government; or are they areas where the government has decided it would be wrong/harmful to take your money?

Do you know how stringent the requirements are to be considered tax-exempt?

Do you realize that businesses owned by a religion are still subject to income tax laws (as well as other taxes?)

It seems that you have a deep seated resentment/dislike of organised religion. I await your responses in that they will help me form my response to your "corporate religion" comment.

Lysis said...

First of all, I would like to thank A_Shadow and Dannyboy for their comments. They have expressed many of my feelings after reading Blowhard’s post. However, I would also like to thank Blowhard for the comment posted under that name. Your passion and power are very exciting. There are no swing doors to dodge here in The Agora, only a colonnade through which anyone can come and go as they please. I think Blowhard’s ideas are every bit as interesting as any. In fact, Blowhard, you are the major stirrer of our discussions. Thank you! I am glad to respond to your questions.

You first asked why the repeated reporting on the deaths in Baghdad is a concern to me. As A_Shadow has pointed out, the murderers committed by these terrorists are encouraged by the publicity they receive from NPR. More importantly, it is the tone used by NPR that frustrates me. These killers are not reported as the monsters they are; rather they are presented as justifiable actors in an insurgent rebellion. This would be like reporting the Holocaust from Hitler’s point of view. By thus elevating these terrorists acts NPR betrays its bias. There should be balanced reporting on the successes in the war on terror – not a constant drumbeat of negativity to support NPR’s political possession. Of course the killing of the Iraqi Judge is newsworthy. But so are thousands of positive interactions between Americans and Iraqis which are NEVER reported on NPR. By selecting only negative news NPR demonstrates its bias. By hiding that bias NPR demonstrates its hypocrisy. As for the bankruptcy story – no effort was made on the part of NPR to present any of the benefits of stopping frivolous bankruptcies. There must have been some reasons that the majority of the House of Representatives supported this bill; these reasons are never mentioned. I certainly want people to know about all the news – NPR does not present all the news – only the stories which demoralize America and comfort her enemies.

“Who is us?” I suppose when I use the word “us” I am referring to all those people who are harmed by not having full access to the truth; who are misled by the endless ranting of the “reporters” on NPR who are in fact propagandists. If you, Blowhard are thus miss-served by your tax supported public radio, you are one of us.

My reference to “toy religion” was meant to point out that those who kill “in the name of Islam” are misrepresenting that faith. True Islam, and true Christianity for that matter, abhors murder and promotes love and brotherhood. Thus, when I was posting a comment that equated “toy soldiers” to misrepresentations in general, I referred to this false Islam as a “toy religion”.

I do not think Christ would be at all surprised or angry to be considered a Greek. I believe Christ, like so many other great men and women would be honored to be counted among all peoples equally. I believe Christ to be the source of all truth, and he surely taught the same truths which had been discovered by the Greeks and He condemned the lies which were taught by Jews who sought to divide peoples and stir up hate based on ethnicity. Please don’t jump to the conclusion that I am calling all Jews evil. All those of any group – even Greek groups – who adopt false beliefs and seek to force them on others by violence and murder – by terror – are evil. It doesn’t matter what language Jesus studied or taught the truths of Greco-Roman culture in; I have myself only read and taught these ideas in English; they still influenced Jesus teachings far more than the words of Leviticus or the other books of the “Old Religion.”

As for my bias – I do not hide it – and I thank you Blowhard for not hiding yours. I condemn NPR for hiding theirs.

I await the answers to Dannyboy’s questions on corporate religion.

Ares said...

First of all, I would like to say that when Apollo and I used the term US, it was meaning that the two of us feel the same way. We in no way try or think that we represent everyone on this blog as we both have been bashed before. If you have even read the comments on this blog recently, you would know that.
Once again, Dannyboy asks the crcuial questions and I think that it is not only obvious that he knows what he is talking about, but that Blowhard does not.
Speaking of which, I neven said that I wanted to shut your butt in a door, I was merely warning you to watch out and that you were free to leave whenever you wanted. It is one of the most irksome things to me when one complains that the "evil mormons" are out to rule the state but then the same person refuses to move or do anything about it.
But, I suppose that I must give credit where credit is due, at least, Blowhard, you have the guts to come on here and speak your mind, you are definitely fighting an uphill battle. Your only problem is that we have Truth on our side (and Lysis and Dannyboy too).

Ares said...

Oh, and how could I forget A_Shadow, perhaps it was only that I could not see him. We are lucky to have such people of wisdom as we do, and I believe that there is a certain amount of wisdom in Blowhard as well, he does come here to try to find Truth, as we all do.

A_Shadow said...

Ah, thank you for adding me to that list, though the name "A_Shadow" comes for many reasons. Most of all is my simultaneous want to be active in the lime light, and overlooked...

I guess maybe it's good that you didn't read the comments on America as a christian nation, I believe that was the post... I don't hold Mormons as being evil, but anyone that denies that they run the state is selling something. They are the majority, and thus (meaning to or not, and like all majorities - they mean to) run the state.

But let's not get sidetracked... My bad.

I guess while we're making the rounds, I suppose when Lysis brings up the good ol' pot stirring there is much thanks to be given to "Blowhard", we seem to get bogged down with little to discuss without him. I just wish he'd blow harder with things that were a little more difficult to define, but then we'd probably exhaust that rather rapidly. But with something as cut and dry as propaganda and the news... I guess I'll have to find the liberal rantings from my newspaper that talked about anytime that Bush said anything it was propaganda... It was rather absurd, something of that like, anyways.

Anonymous said...

Blowhard here . . .
This has to be done in parts.
Dan says:
"How much do you know about OUR (the?) Federal tax structure?"
(sorry Dan, I am going to wean myself away from using the ubiquitous collective plural personal pronouns of we, us, our, ours, and they and I wish you would do the same.)
I do know -- God fearing, loyal,patriotic,tax paying, pledge saying, organized religion going, (I once heard a person say,"I belong to no organized religion, I'm a Mormon.") veteran, etc. etc. etc. Is this enough to get my "worthiness" ticket punched Dan or would you like to continue to "shadow box" with who and what you think (hope?)I am? -- That ALL taxes,
Federal, State, City, ALL, come down to
"Whose ox gets gored?" The structure of administering the goring/nongoring doesn't make it any better or worse.

Do you consider tax exemption the same thing as the government giving you (NPR?) money out of the general fund?

If NPR has 14 mil "given" to it (which I hardly think is the case) out of the general fund, I think THAT 14 million equals a 14 million dollars gained from tax write offs of property taxes that did not have to be paid because of a government created tax exemption.

Corporate religion has its own tactics of corporate welfare -- not to say that it is necessarily bad, but it IS welfare, like it or not.

More responses forthcoming:

Ares said...

Well, not to get too sidetracked, but I was under the immpression that Utah was actually closer to only 50% Mormon, but I suppose that if no one group also holds 50%, that would mean that the Mormons are in the majority. I am willing to accept that members of the LDS faith do "run the state" by the sheer definition of majority as stated by a_shadow. The problem that I run into is that because the majority of the LDS people in this state are very conservative, liberals in this state often times will equate the rule of the Republican party with the rule of the LDS faith. Granted many laws that are (or at least are tried to be) passed do have a very LDS spin on them, I would challenge anyone to find a law that prohibits something that is perfectly safe. Now, I can already imagine the wheels in your collective minds turning and saying things like, "what about prohibition laws or laws about the adult entertainment business or anti-gambling? They seem to be perfectly safe and we have laws against them here."
But before you think these things, remember that we are not the only ones who have such laws and they are in sometimes very liberal areas where Mormons play a small part in the population if any at all.
Also, if you get drunk, go find a diverson, and then go to a casino and gamble away your family's grocery money, how is that not unsafe?
But we digress.

Ares said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Ares said...

Sorry about that, please don't think that I was trying to hide anything, I just hit login and publish twice by mistake and I didn't think that you wanted me to bore you twice as much.
Sorry once again,

Dan Simpson said...

Blowhard: I don't understand why you feel the need to go through such dramatics when you answer.

I was not making any judgements or comments with my questions, I was trying to find out what your stances on certain tax rules were. After actually getting some concrete answers from you (something that is nearly impossible) I would have then made a comment on your Corporate religion post.

First, unless you aren't a citizen it is OUR federal tax structure, and no I will not discontinue the use of such words.

Lets step away from specifics that are filled with your personal biases. My question was do you consider tax exemptions to be the same as money given out of the general fund. I would still like to know your answer.

I would also like you to explain your use of " " around the word given when talking about money given from the general fund to an organization. Please explain.

Also I would like you to explain this statement.

"Corporate religion has its own tactics of corporate welfare"

I also have a request, leave the melodramatics out of it. I don't care if you once met the Dhali Lama and he told you he once cheated on his taxes. I don't care what a mormon told you about "organized religion", at least not in this context, I was asking about taxes, to respond with these types of hyped up responses smacks of defensiveness. I wasn't questioning your "worthiness", most people don't know much about the tax code, I wondered how much you knew before I began to comment on your statements.

A_Shadow said...

Ares, to continue our little side topic, that is why it is so hard to determine the difference between a Republican and a conservative, most times.

Conservatives tend to want things to stay the same, and Republicans have a lot of beliefs along those lines. It's like "The enemy of my enemy is my friend." The reason why Utah isn't a battle ground state (which I think sucks because I want to go to a political rally at least once) is because Mormons are conservative. Their religious doctrine doesn't allow for abortions because they share belief in the 10 commandments, one of which is "Thou shalt not kill." As for Republicans, this belief is also usually largely based off of their religious beliefs, one way or another, but some conservatives have even fought Liberals and Democrats with the fire of undeniable logic. Of course, they deny it.

There are very few things, that I can find (or have found), that seperate Republicans from Conservatives. Republicans are the more conservative party, after all...

After that, just two more points. We are once again back to the argument that two wrongs don't make a right. If Nevada has laws that make prostitution and gambling legal, shouldn't we? After all we wouldn't be the only state with those laws. It's a flawed excuse. A law needs be based on justice, not excused away because there are other states with it.

And finally, I'm not even likely 75% sure on this, but are there any other states that have anything close to a 50% population margine on religion? Protestants are all different religions, maybe there are states with that percentage that are Catholic, or one of the protestant groups, but I can't think of any concrete examples. But they are the same way, and I bet that for the most part, non-believers there would share some frustrations of not being able to do what they want. But I don't know of too many other faiths that keep their children in for fear of breaking the sabbath...

Anonymous said...

Blowhard here . . .
Taken in parts again.

In response to Dan --

"blatantly laughable"
"ridiculous arguments"
"Why do you bother to post?"
"Do you claim to be responding..."
"Your argument didn't deserve a response."
"You are becoming more patronizing and annoying by the post."
"You . . distort people's comments."
"You smile smugly."
"You are a pompous condescending blowhard."

(those of the most recent postings are)
"hyped up responses."
"You have a deep resentment /dislike of organized religion."
"I wonder how much you knew before I began to comment on your statements."

Dan says also:
"Blowhard, I don't know why you feel the need to go through so much dramatics when you answer."
. . . leave the dramatics out of it."

"I was not making any judgements or comments with my questions . . ."

Bloward is dramatic?
Blowhard is defensive?

I made an observation yesterday about "Shadowboxing". I think
Dan is really debating/posturing/ attacking against that which he most fears in HIMSELF -- not very much with anything I have written -- I'm the shadow he can't hit because I'm not "concrete". Well, I know why! It's your OWN shadow Dan, not mine.

I think my statement that ALL taxes -- Federal, state, city, come down to "Whose ox gets gored?" should be concrete enough to "chew on" for a moment anyway.
Also, I think I applied my answer to the "structure" part of your question so that I wouldn't be seen as evading the question.

Otherwise, how would you have me respond to that question? "How much do I know about the Federal Tax structure?"
Do YOU want to know about the Federal tax structure, because you want to be edified by my wisdom? Not hardly. Or, do you want me to defer to YOUR greater wisdom and vast experience? Ditto. I really didn't/don't see the relevance of the question -- so I split the difference and tried to respond by depesonalizing the question and by pulling it into some kind of relevance to the topic at hand, which has long been forgotten -- How church tax write offs and economic privileges are like NPR's government supported subsidies/status. I wrote the "Bio" in an attempt to curtail all the personal attacks (listed above) from which Dan cannot refrain.
I hate to explain -- it seems like such a waste of time and is so unsatisfying. And those who don't get it still wont get it.

Here I wanted to respond to Lysis and the "Greek Jesus" and the rest of Dan's questions, and statements by others, but I got caught up in the "black hole" of expaining.

A_Shadow said...

I thought I was the shadow...


I hope to never get caught up in the "black hole of expaining" sounds pointless...

Now that I've sufficiently caught up to the frivilousness of "Blowhard"'s comments... I believe that he made at least one good point in all of that mess. He doesn't use anything concrete to defend or attack against and with, and thus we are shadowboxing with him. The difference is that, from one incorporeal being to another, I know the tricks of the trade, and others have been rather quick to catch on. We know that you don't bring anything useful to the battlefield except your person. You bring a stick to stir the pot, but it doesn't really exist. The point of DannyBoy asking you what you knew wasn't really so that he could toot his own horn, nor give you the same opportunity, it was exactly to avoid your "black hole of expaining" that you fell into. He realized the potential uselessness of making an educational statement to a potentially educated audience, but in typical form you missed the assist and attacked its semantics instead... You should simply answer direct questions, I think it would help you more, but instead you just end up blowing harder. The wind rages on and on and on and on without end, but it's only a wind. If there were anythin substantial, we would have a debate. But this has been said for a few weeks now and I'm almost getting used to it.

So, probably for the last time - since it's been asked just about everytime someone responds to you: "Do you have any proof, anecdotal or otherwise, or even a sliver of a maybe that we could debate with?"

If you're going to argue on the par of the other immiturities of the internet, you could at least throw in the good ol' Hitler/Nazi reference. You've got the "evade any and all truth and simply debate until one of you gives up" approach down. There's an article on if you really wanted the help.

Anonymous said...

Blowhard here . . .

Shadow too says:
"If there were anything substantial WE would have a debate."

I am curious about your use of the collective "we".
Is it because you are using the Royal prerogative, the "Royal WE" because you are King of something? (maybe debate) . . or
Are you using "we" instead of "I" because of a wish to be "anonymous and communal" and to simply accede to the opinions of others without discrimination. Just to be one of the guys? . . . . or
Are you the official spokesman/person of some group who allows you to speak for them and who really have no voice of their own?

I choose "WE" number one Monty.

As king of debate, Shadow
(here comes the punch line)

"What do you know about debate?"

Have fun . . . but BE careful.

The shadow/we criteria for answering questions is:

-No explanations. "we" et al think they are weak.
-No semantics! (only "we" know/s what this means.
-Be concrete. Use ONLY statistics and FACTS.
-You may use something called "anecdotal" or "sliver of maybe" but only if "we" think/s its ok.
-Please do not evade truth.

Dan can have at this one too, unless, he and shadow; et al, would like to write a "collective" response.

Anonymous said...

Blowhard here . . .

Shadow too says:
"If there were anything substantial WE would have a debate." (emphasis my own)

I am curious about your use of the collective "we".
Is it because you are using the Royal prerogative, the "Royal WE" because you are King of something? (maybe debate) . . or
Are you using "we" instead of "I" because of a wish to be "anonymous and communal" and to simply accede to the opinions of others without discrimination. Just to be one of the guys? . . . . or
Are you the official spokesman/person of some group who allows you to speak for them and who really have no voice of their own?

I choose "WE" number one, Monty.

As king of debate, Shadow
(here comes the punch line)

"What do you know about debate?"

Have fun . . . but BE careful.

The shadow/we criteria for answering questions is:

-No explanations. "we" et al think they are weak.
-No semantics! (only "we" know/s what this means.
-Be concrete. Use ONLY statistics and FACTS.
-You may use something called "anecdotal" or "sliver of maybe" but only if "we" think/s its ok.
-Please do not evade truth.

Dan can have at this one too, unless, he and shadow; et al, would like to write a "collective" response to the question.

Dan Simpson said...

I stand by my original post. I would like an answer to any of the questions that I asked. If you don't want to answer them, thats okay.

If you want to paint me in the light you do thats fine too. I suppose I could go back and find one or two word phrases from things you have written, but I hardly think it would be telling of what you were saying in your previous posts.

I asked you the first question, not to try to tout my knowledge of the tax system (I am only currently taking a Federal Income Tax Law class now, everything I knew before this came from the 1040 EZ.), but to actually see what you knew. Like I said before, very few people know much about our federal tax code.

If you want to take offense where it was not meant, feel free, but bear in mind, when I mean offense I don't sugar coat it, I just say what I mean. You're still a blowhard, but that doesn't change the fact that I was TRYING to engage you in an actual discussion of tax policy.

Whatever kind of boxing I AM doing, you are to slippery to allow yourself to get involved in a real match.

Beef Jerky said...

Our dear friend Bolwhard reminds me of someone else rather amusing:

"It depends on what the meaning of the word 'is' is. If the--if he--if 'is' means is and never has been, that is not--that is one thing. If it means there is none, that was a completely true statement....Now, if someone had asked me on that day, are you having any kind of sexual relations with Ms. Lewinsky, that is, asked me a question in the present tense, I would have said no. And it would have been completely true(footnote 1,128 in Starr's report)."

Can anyone figure out who this is and why Blowhard reminds me of him?

Ares said...

Perhaps you are right, using another state as an example could be a weak excuse. The only problem that I see is that in the south, the Southern Baptists are very much a majority (I'm not sure if they are 50%, but still) and I don't hear anything from the southerners about unjustices enacted by them. And another thing, I think that most of them are Conservative too, just look at the last election.
Oh, and I think that the Jewish people have something about their children going out on the Sabath too.

Aeneas said...

I concluded years ago that the Federal government should stop giving money to NPR and PBS. The money would be better spent elsewhere. I know this comment doesn't really address the "why" of media bias, but it does suggest that the government should stop supporting leftist propoganda just as it should stop sending money to countries who hate America. This country is so rich that we have a tendency to be too loose with our money, whether it is being used to meddle in domestic states' affairs or attempting to buy friends overseas. Congress, stop flushing our hard earned tax dollars down the toilet!!

That's all I have to say about that.

Oh yeah, some of you need to lighten up about the Shoshone comment. It was a joke!

A_Shadow said...

Ah, the wonderfulness of being an idiot. How I wish I could just shrivel into an ignorant shell and yell myself hoarse at the rest of the world...

You missed the all important one, there, Blowhard. We was actually referring to the mouse in my pocket. See, the reason that I keep him around is that we are of the same mind. He actually allows me to be in multiple places at one time, so I figured I might as well give him some credit somewhere. He deserves it for sure.

As for the sliver of a maybe, that's why I put that there. It's not hard and fast evidence that I would base my comments on, like you do. Your entire arguments aren't even slivers of a maybe, they are crap and trite. I put that there so that my doubt could be overlooked and/or reaffirmed. The point for making the comment like that is that if someone could reaffirm it they would, and if not, it's not the keypoint anyways and can be easily dropped...

I appologise for not commenting sooner, blogspot's been giving me trouble and I traveled a bit. It was hardly worth the effort to get back to Blowhard's comment anyways, but it does give me something to do.

I find it humorous that someone who hates getting into the "blackhole of expaining" likes to drag us all down there anyways. I'm hardly the only one establishing a hard and fast criterion around here, so if you're going to sling mud my direction, you shouldn't be wearing any of it yourself. But now that I'm stuck in the "blackhole of expaining", enjoy!

About Medicine Blog said...

It shows the economy continuing to grow,
something that liberals obviously don't want.